Police vs drunks and why you’re an idiot


Here’s a Louisiana wedding that turns into a police vs. drunks contest…

As far as I can tell, they all got rip-roaring drunk, somebody called the EMTs and some men from the wedding party decided to attack the EMTs. The police showed up and here’s what happened.

I’ll share some thoughts and a mini-rant afterwards, first watch the video:

Alright, here are my thoughts, more or less unfiltered:

  • If you attack EMTs, you’re an idiot.
  • If you attack LEO’s, you’re an idiot.
  • If you can’t tell the difference between both and decide to attack, you’re a drunk idiot.
  • If you don’t understand why doing so is stupid, you’re an idiot.
  • If you think the drunk idiots were “in their right” to attack the police or feel it’s only understandable, you’re an idiot too.

And now the mini-rant:
If you want to shit on the police and whine about “police brutality” in this video, don’t comment. Just leave my blog and don’t return.

99% of LEO’s work their asses off and put their lives on the line every day. They typically get very little respect for it. I’m sick and tired of people living in the comforts of modern society, where LEO’s act in a more professional way than ever before in history, and whine about getting their little duck feelings hurt when a LEO does something they neither understand, nor know how it has to be performed.

And yes, 1% of LEOs are power-hungry assholes who abuse their badge. They exist, I know. There are assholes in all walks of life, including whatever profession you hold. So you’re bound to come into contact with one of them sooner or later. But making a blanket statement of ” Fuck the police! They’re all pigs!” is bullshit. It’s the same thing as saying “Fuck the people! They’re all assholes!” because of the 1% who make trouble for everybody whereas the 99% of people just want to live their lives and mind their own business.

Let’s imagine you do have officer-asshole on your case: in what way does being belligerent and aggressive help your case? If you think you can “win” by attacking such an officer, you are stupid and delusional. The best way to interact with any police officer is to:

  • Be polite.
  • Obey his lawful orders.

If something happens that you don’t like, you can file a complaint afterwards. That’s how the system works in the modern world. Anything else is stupid. Don’t like it? Pick up politics and change the system.
If you do want to whine about brutal LEOs and think fighting them is your God-given right, come with me to some of the third-world countries I’ve been too. I’ll show you what police brutality really looks like. And then I want to see you give attitude, lip off or attack those local LEOs.

Guess what, you’ll shit your pants and transform into a quiet little altar boy on the spot, just like everybody else. Because you’ll know right away you’ll get beaten to a pulp or shot dead if you pull any of the crap those idiots at the wedding did.
If you only act like that when you’re faced with LEOs in a modern country, where you know they have to abide by laws and regulations, then you’re an idiot, a coward and a bully all at the same time.

If that’s you, then I have only one thing left to tell you:

That is all.

I feel all better now.

Time for some herbal tea while I sing “Kumbaya”…

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Comments

  1. David Pirie says:

    To, “obey lawful orders” I would add, “obey reasonable orders”. For instance, if a cop asks you to back up, and it’s not technically lawful for him or her to do so, just do it. They probably don’t feel safe having you so close to them for some reason and it’s no real skin off your nose to do so. Yeah, you may have to swallow some pride to do so but, you’re an adult, right? I think you can handle it.

    • Yup.
      A good rule of thumb would be: what are the consequences of not obeying that order?
      If disobeying means you make the LEO’s work more difficult, you’re an idiot.
      If it means he has to spend more time on handling you than on handling the problem at hand, you’re an idiot.
      IOW, stay the hell ouf of it.

      Most problems that escalate into what people claim is police brutality start from not STFU and getting in the way or ignoring the order to back the hell up.
      Once the police gets involved, it’s no longer about your little duck feelings or personal opinions. It’s about the LEO having both the legal authority and obligation to handle the problem according to the policies he has to abide by. That’s the way modern societies are set up. Those who disagree with that should try their luck in those African countries, where societies are much less modern. See how they like it there…

  2. read Orwell!

    the police are our servants! they get paid with our money, to protect us! If an oligarchy manages to use them to curtail our rights, then it is our democratic “JOB” to challenge such! To dismiss such is to dismiss Gandi etc.

    was the heavy handed methods of the New York Police justified in their oppression of the Occupy movement? Must we agree protests? So it suits the oppressors? Wake Up!!!!!!!

    Being stupid and at fault is never justified, but I draw the line at police never to being challenged!

    • The police are there to protect you but you also have obligations towards them. One of those is obeying lawful orders. That’s how a modern Western democracy works. You are obviously free to challenge them, which is done by filing complaints and dragging them into court. If you try to do it by being belligerent and violent while they are working, I fear you’ll only get yourself into deeper trouble and not achieve your goal of challenging them.

  3. We once had a “Citizen Army” here in Ireland to protect us from British Police!

    • The Troubles, in many ways, were a civil war. During that time, your country was not a democratic society like the ones I was writing about. I think you’re missing my point Niall.

  4. I do hear what you are saying Wim, and regard the video the logic is without flaw… just feel it needs to be pointed out that such “powers” need a slap on the nose occasionally for all our good!

  5. Let’s imagine you do have officer-asshole on your case: in what way does being belligerent and aggressive help your case? If you think you can “win” by attacking such an officer, you are stupid and delusional. The best way to interact with any police officer is to:
    Be polite.
    Obey his lawful orders.

    Its this part I’m addressing, as for drunks well… that’s obvious!

    • Cant agree Wim, with drunks etc. absolutely!

      with asshole cops or en-masse acting against democracy for the “paying” oligarchy no way!

      play by the rules and you are like a boxer fooled into fighting the opponent’s fight. You are correct – my country has experience with oppressors and civil war. no advantage was gained playing by their rules, that is the object of their rules!

      Yes it demands sacrifice, even / often risk of one’s own and families life. The alternative is the enslavement and oppression of your children, that’s worth fighting against!

      Cops are usually dumb to politics and to how they are being used! They are usually the ultimate “Uncle Toms”.

      Great if you can catch them out. or better still outsmart them “playing by their rules”, but there are certain times the majority (ordinary people) need to react against authority! if they don’t want to be taken the piss out of entirely!

      • Like I said, I’m talking about modern democracies, not oligarchies like you are. The difference is critical.

        Also, you’re painting all LEOs all across the world with a mighty big brush there. I know plenty of them. Dumb to politics or the ultimate Uncle Tom is not what I would call them, at all. You do realize you’re including Dan in that category, right?

        • Niall Keane says:

          Ah! I know Wim, just playing devils advocate in a way, and pointing out the “grey”.

          I do think that civil liberties have been under attack for over a decade and that mainstream media tries to convince people that its for their own good. I worry about the sentiment of agreeing to police demands simply to have an easier ride.

          In Ireland recently we have had police being heavy handed with protestors AFTER taking their IDs off! there was youtube of it and a subsequent investigation, which was bungled so no police were convicted. By all accounts Irelands “democracy” is as “healthy” as any other EU state ;-)

          On the video you posted the drunks are atttacking other public servants etc. and it is a common problem for hospital staff and ambulance workers etc. no sympathy what so ever for drunk scum like that!

          • Just to give you an idea: 3 out of every 4 days of the year, there are protests in Brussels. The city of Brussels hardly ever refuses them. That means that I can almost never go to my own capital without being stuck in horrible traffic because a group of people is exercising their civil liberties. Just to give you an idea of scale. So perhaps civil liberties are under attack In Ireland but for now, protesters seem to have more than ample opportunity to do their thing in the rest of Europe…

            This is not uncommon by the way. Whenever I go to London or Paris, there’s also protests in the streets. Invariably, the protestors seem to be left alone, provided they are peaceful themselves. And there’s the rub. For the last decade or so, there has been the rise of professional rioters. They are organized and trained. They know what will entice the police to use force and do everything in their ^power to provoke it. They also train specifically to make sure it is captured on camera and made out to look the worst possible way for the police. So if you’re talking about grey, take that into account too. Every time you see a large protest, you can bet some good money on the fact that there will be an organized group in the masses, ready to light it all up. This is all documented by the way, I’m not making anything up. If you look for it, you will find this information. It rubs people the wrong way but that doesn’t make it untrue.
            I would recommend you read Loren’s book Riot for some more detailed information. It’s worth it.

            As for Occupy Wall Street, that’s another can of worms. Try this and this

  6. Rick Guzman says:

    Thank you for writing on this topic. I couldn’t agree with you more.

  7. Kevin Keough says:

    Wim,

    Great post. After watching the video I think the police showed extraordinary restraint. Let’s just stick with the US. Someone tell me when you have a right to show attitude to a cop much less assault one ? (In the unlikely event he is shit-faced drunk, there are no other cops around and he is beating your 12 yo daughter—–and then I’d recommend chin na till the police arrive). Point is showing attitude to a cop is NEVER a smart move or justified. Too many guys provoke cops so they can get a beating and then whine about it for eons to come.

    During nearly a decade of doing ridealongs with police officers, moving with them to respond to calls I never say a cop abuse authority. Now I saw countless incidents of citizens shitting on police in various ways. Each time someone took a swing at a cop, mouthed off, ran from, became menacing, etc. I stepped in to thump them on the hood of a patrol car. Why and under what authority ?

    Why ? Because usually the cop was taken off guard and would have gotten hurt. And because in my experience cops are always on the defensive. They expect to be reported by citizens and not backed up by supervisors. After a high speed chase the cop would be amped and the suspect would be ready to fight. At the first sight of a fight—–in the suspects eyes—I would put him down. I was not interested in “waiting” for the first swing.

    A fleeing suspect? If I had the jump on him I’d tackle him.

    People mouthing off to cops in their homes ? Tell them to shut the fuck up, we were called to the address, and we didn’t want to be there, so sit the fuck down, or I’ll put you down, and you will apologize to the police officers.

    Under what authority did I act ? If riding with rookies frankly I had more experience. I had a responsibility to protect a cop in a perilous situation. Because I wore a coat and tie and my cell looked like a gun most people mistook me for a “higher up”.

    Oh, I would say for the cops what they couldn’t say. These guys were not able to cuss without getting written up. So I whispered sweet nothings in their ears.

    And the police officers were chronically tired.They couldn’t remember the addresses or calls. They couldn’t spot when guys switched drivers or which street we’d just been on.

    The cops needed a helping hand. We would do “therapy” on the way to calls or running through the woods. They got to like having me around. They knew I would vouch for them. Most importantly, they knew they had back up immediately vs. 5-15 min away.

    Granted we had an unusual arrangement. The Chiefs knew it. Everyone knew it but we didn’t talk about it. I didn’t overstep my bounds. Clarification, I always got the nod from a cop before I did anything.

    As for those who’d mess with cops—be careful—you never know who might be riding with them.

    And as Wim said: You are an idiot and shut the fuck up. And obey all orders unless you want a beat-down you can whine about.

    What is the fuck is this “attitude toward cop” thing ? Get over it whiners

    • Niall Keane says:

      Batman?

    • Darrin Kemp says:

      Mr. Keough
      With all due respect sir,I have a huge problem with a civilian on ride alongs behaving like a LEO. Have you considered the liability isssue alone? If you get into it with someone in their home, acting under color of auhority that you don’t have?
      Attitude? If for whatever reason I have contact with LEO’s and people who are not LEO’s start acting like i have to listen to them we are going to have a problem.And I’ll end up sueing you AND the cops because they let you assume authority that isn’t yours.
      As an African American my life is hard enough.No one beleives you’re really a law abiding citizen.I mean,come on, you’re black.You must have been doing something wrong.Why would you be stopped and frisked?Not because the bosses push the officers to make numbers so they can get thier promotions right? NO.

      • Kevin Keough says:

        Mr. Kemp,

        I appreciate your concerns which are probably shared by a majority of people. However, I’m presenting an atypical arrangement in which all the risk management, legal, etc had been examined up front and along the way. It was no secret how things were.

        We were often rolling into “deadzones” where officers couldn’t call for back-up to domestics, knife fights, early stage riots, hostile crowds, people becoming aggressive toward lone police officers with a police psychologist along for the shift. Politicians were exceedingly slow to fix the brand new Emergency Communications System so it was far beyond ordinary and customary circumstances. Under these conditions no one cares about your sensitivities and will hand you to names and contact info so you can file lawsuits. Sad to say but in addition to mitigating circumstances, the fact you’d play the race card would work against you.

        Now, the ridealong has a responsibility as a citizen to assist an officer to the degree of their ability and according to the instruction of the police officer. When two people, only one of whom is a police officer find themselves in calls that would be considered hairy by 6-6 police officers, K-9, and helicopter————–no one thinks or cares about a problem citizen’s opinions–particularly when the race card is played. Sorry Mr.Kemp but the black card just gets as boring as it is outrageous—in some jurisdictions. Sure, there is truth in your point but please remember it isn’t true everywhere.

        I encourage you to read Heather MacDonald’s essays on the “stop and frisk” policy and procedure. Absolutely, there is risk of abuse but there is some decent research it can work like a charm.

        I have been on the wrong end of encounters with police officers abusing power and being unprofessional. It is a helpless feeling. However It doesn’t alter my inclination to give cops the benefit of the doubt until clear evidence proves misbehavior. Yes, as a black man it’s probable you have had more negative experiences. Still, reality teaches that one’s best move is to be deferential and cooperative. Period. The farther you move from this position the more you invite problems——–problems you now have a clear role in creating.

        Best to refrain from showing any actions or attitudes that will increase the chances of an unpleasant outcone for you or me or whomever.

        • Niall Keane says:

          are you saying “rights” shpuld be abandoned when resourses are low?

          The police are there “supposedly” to protect our rights, if in carrying out their “public duty” such rights are abused, then they are part of the problem, not the solution, perhaps why many view police as “the biggest gang in the world”?

          Nothing is a black and white issue, (except perhaps skin colour in the USA if we consider prosecution tendency and enprisonment demographics?) but what i mean is im sure there are good LEOs, but i feel there is a tendency as an LEO to see the negative in people (justify it as precaution if you like) due to overexposure to bad shit, and such reasoning seems to encourage prejudice, and a justification towards brutality?

    • To all: emotions are running high in this thread. Please read the comments policy again before replying.
      http://www.wimsblog.com/2010/07/comments-policy-meet-the-lord-of-the-land/
      If it goes out of hand again, I’ll shut it down.

  8. Great conversation. Disturbing “what brutality looks like.” Thanks Wim, it’s great the way you see-saw back and forth anticipating the arguments and highlighting the extremes. And, of course, I agree with you – well, I would hope “stupid” rather than “idiot” but…

    And, or but, my instinct is to agree with Niall in spirit and to being hyper vigilant in such circumstances as to who’s interests are being served by whom. Better to use a tool than to be a tool. And… a chimp is a chimp whether (at any given moment) they wear the title “groom” or the title LEO.

    Thanks.

    Dennis

    • Understood Dennis and in spirit, I don’t really disagree either. If it were at all possible, I’d make a truckload of changes to modern societies. But nobody died and made me enlightened despot, so it’ll probably be for another life. :-) That said, it irks me when people watch videos like the one of the wedding and then spout bile on the LEOs like there’s no tomorrow (read the comments on Youtube…). OK then, if they are really a bunch of pigs, then those same people should forfeit their right to call upon the police when somebody else infringes upon their rights by stealing form them, raping them, murdering them, etc. You can have it both ways. You can’t bitch and whine about LEOs and then go cry to them when *you*are the one who’s in trouble. That’s the hypocrisy that annoys the crap out of me.
      Or if they want to be really consistent, then let’s abolish the police wholesale and see what happens. If they’re all just a bunch of incompetent pigs, let’s just get rid of the institution and go back to anarchy. I give it two days before mass chaos sweeps the nation.
      If they don’t want to do that either, then they can at least give LEO’s some goddamn courtesy and respect for having the balls to do a dangerous and unappreciated job. Doesn’t mean you have to like them. Doesn’t mean you have to agree with them as an institution. But until anybody can come up with a better solution, that’s the least they can do. Same goes for EMTs, firefighters, ER MDs and nurses, etc.

      I’ve been to countries where the police is feared and hated for good reason. I’ve seen first hand what it’s like. The US as a whole is *nowhere* near that. By far. The same goes for most Western democracies. So I really think some perspective is in order. This of course doesn’t excuse the 1% of bad cops out there. But if you want a 100% guarantee on something, buy a toaster. Because there’s no certainties anywhere else.

      OK, I’ll start breathing slowly again now… ;-)